Testing Syphon with Modul8
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    VjKg
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    by VjKg » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:55 pm

    Garagecube team, Will you be my Valentine? Any, non-binding, estimates on the new release? I know firsthand the trials and tribulations of development, but I have been checking the site every couple hours since the update was announced and I need my life back. Your software rocks hard, but I have a great need for this update as do many of my Visual brethren. My new MacBook Pro should be here soon and I want to really "wow" people at my next big gig on March 4th.
  • ilan

    by ilan » Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:59 pm

    We do not set dates for releases. It would be dishonest to set a date and then, because of unforeseen circumstances, have to delay it.

    My personal advice is to stop checking the site daily. Creativity is the true fuel. There is plenty of 'wow' to be made with the current tool set.
  • cycloptic
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    by cycloptic » Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:59 pm

    Ilan there is nothing dishonest about coming forward with an estimate that may then be delayed, we are not children.
    slow development combined with somewhat patronising communication are what's draining the 'wow" from the current tool set.
  • ilan

    by ilan » Tue Feb 15, 2011 11:11 pm

    For the record, I do not dictate the policy of GarageCUBE.

    In this case the policy set by this company is that it does not provide release dates until it is 100% sure that it can meet that goal.
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    VjKg
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    by VjKg » Wed Feb 16, 2011 12:54 am

    I have nothing but love for the software and the team that supports it. I also appreciate the post from david about "in the next couple weeks". In my heart of hearts I was hoping that meant 3 weeks not 10. I working on a gig that is using all 10 layers. It is tricky to adjust the layers for more variety. I think MadMapper and Syphon support will really make it pop.

    Can any of the power users recommend a good way to change between both layer sets fluidly? Can I map both layer sets to a knob on a midi controller? I have not really tried and I just thought of it, but I have had issues in the past mapping a single knob to more then one thing in Modul8 interface.
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    by vanakaru » Wed Feb 16, 2011 10:19 am

    cycloptic wrote:... we are not children.
    ......the 'wow" from the current tool set.


    To me these two statements contradict each other. I try to argue against new toys every time I see such request. M8 is pretty complex app already with lots of possibilities I have not used yet and most likely never will. I have tried many new modules I thought to be fantastic at first but over time never load again. Just like children do with new toys. Luckily the app itself gets used all the time last 6 years.
    The reason why new updates are announced carefully comes from the past experience I think. There were times when Apple broke a lot with every QuickTime update and devs had to work hard and fast to keep app running instead of getting on with the development. And people move on sometimes.
    For me the patronizing tone is rather appropriate when users beg *can we have this soon, please, please!*.
  • cycloptic
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    by cycloptic » Wed Feb 16, 2011 2:01 pm

    the statements do not contradict each other. we are able to deal with delays and cautious development, this is part of the world we have chosen to work in. I am saying that it's unhelpful to users to keep them at a "safe distance" rather than build a constructive and open dialogue. a patronising tone is completely inappropriate in such a niche community of users and developers.

    I can categorically say that i use almost all of modul8's features on a permanent basis, i build my own modules and am constantly streamlining my use of this software to bring it as close as possible to a true instrument. I frequently construct projects based entirely on the testcard, and as you can imagine, this pulls ALL of it's "wow" from the software itself.
    And it is with a heavy heart that I feel I need to say that yes, i am starting to scrape the bottom of the barrel when it comes to regions of modul8 whose potential i have yet to exploit.

    Syphon changes this drastically, completely opening up my current weathered tool set to outside applications, that can themselves become the "toys" without hindering the stability or core functionality of modul8.
    I don't want more toys, I just want this toy to end all toys.
  • cycloptic
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    by cycloptic » Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:52 pm

    well i guess having syphon ready for my tour was definitely a pipe dream as there is still no word on 2.6.2...

    for what it's worth, this is the project i'm touring.

    http://dipdive.com/member/Daedelus/media/176172

    syphon and mapping of the mechatronics would've been awesome...
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    The Midi Thief
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    by The Midi Thief » Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:57 pm

    Well then you aren't reading the news properly. MadMapper will be released during the Mapping festival in May and then a new Syphon abled version of Modul8 will be available.
  • cycloptic
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    by cycloptic » Fri Apr 15, 2011 2:09 pm

    well that's good news, but still far away from the "next few weeks" initially declared
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    vade
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    by vade » Fri Apr 15, 2011 11:24 pm

    cycloptic wrote:well that's good news, but still far away from the "next few weeks" initially declared


    Bitch and moan. Get over it.

    Development takes time, there are unforeseen issues, ask anyone who does software development or even remotely follows the industry knows this.
  • cycloptic
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    by cycloptic » Mon Apr 18, 2011 3:40 pm

    vade wrote:Bitch and moan. Get over it.

    Development takes time, there are unforeseen issues, ask anyone who does software development or even remotely follows the industry knows this.


    Excuse me!???
    I'm a paying customer, sir.
    I'm not asking for a favour, I have PAID FOR A SERVICE and have recommended that many of my peers follow suit.
    Since V2.5, significant development of my chosen brand of "vj software" has been slight or non-existant, I no longer feel I have the most powerful or useful tool at my service to do my job, and i am frustratingly voicing my concern, as have many others.
    And no, i don't "do software development" or "follow the industry" this is none of my concern, I'm a video, lighting, and set designer by trade and those are the industries i "do" and "follow".
    I don't keep up to date on the latest in flightcase design either in case you were wondering.
  • ilan

    by ilan » Mon Apr 18, 2011 6:34 pm

    Ok.

    It is totally legitimate to voice ones concerns. I have no problem with that. But please keep the aggressive tone to a minimum.


    What vade is pointing to is a reality of the development process.


    I have stated this previously and I am repeating it here again: It simply takes time to get things right and rushing the software out to meet demands is a recipe for disaster.

    Personally, I would like to say more about what we are working on and provide a road map for future development. But that is not the policy of this company and I have to adhere to that policy.

    What I can say is that Modul8 is a viable solution for the majority of our community and that is growing every day. They do not have the demands that some of our 'power users' have, and so it goes that some of them seek out other more immediate solutions.

    Because of the aforementioned point about not rushing things, the team is taking its time and focusing on what it feels are the necessary steps to move forward.

    The team is focused now on getting the MadMapper out by late May. It is an ambitious timeline but they really hope to meet it for everyone's benefit.
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    vade
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    by vade » Mon Apr 18, 2011 6:37 pm

    You are a paying customer for *existing* available software, and paid for what was out and available when you made your purchase.

    You are not paying for a service. As a software developer, (I am not affiliated with Garagecube or 1024), I can say strictly speaking, people who look at software as service piss me off to no end. What you have paid for is a product. The fact that Garagecube is considerate enough to give you

    a) features and bug fixes for free
    b) insight into future product development

    Does not give you license to complain about the lack of release of a product you have not paid for and will likely get gratis (at least Modul8 + Syphon - my understanding is MadMappr is separate purchase).

    Unless you are on some contractual "yearly licensed upgrade subscription" then perhaps you have right to call yourself a subscriber, but that does not give you "license" to complain about upcoming releases not fitting with your production schedule.

    Designing/conceiving a production system/tour around unreleased, announced, untested software solutions (especially ones involving multiple software solutions like Syphon, which I conceived of, prototyped and helped fully realize), is daft and, frankly unprofessional. While I am confident in Garagecubes software development team to put out solid working solutions, such undertakings are non trivial. I know this for a fact, as I stated, I have been working on Syphon for some time now, and am well aware of the non-triviality of inter application, high definition, almost zero overhead frame sharing.

    To then come on to a forum and complain about the lack of release of new and experimental software because of some vague promise of an eventual release is, well, just being pushy. Thus my original comment regarding bitching and moaning.

    You can now add "entitled" to my previous statement. As I have said, but want to make clear, I have no affiliation with Garagecube, I just respond as I see fit.

    Ilan I just saw your response (as your posted, i was editing my post), apologies if this came off as too aggressive, feel free to tell me to shut up and or go away :)
  • ilan

    by ilan » Mon Apr 18, 2011 7:16 pm

    @vade,

    I appreciate your detailed points about the software development process. I respect your knowledge of it and it is good to have your providing insight here in the forums.

    I won't tell you to shut up ;) But please do keep the four letter words to a minimum.

    @cycloptic If you look past the four letter words everything vade is pointing out here is the reality of software development. I am sure you reach points in your own work where you must say to your client 'no, this is not possible given x, y and z in the amount of time you are asking for it' or 'no, this is not possible at all.'

    We do not make it public knowledge, but we do offer the possibility of adding custom features on demand providing that a budget is offered in return for breaking away from development and the upkeep of the current software. For the most part though, we prefer it that everyone benefit from new features as we can make them available.

    And most importantly, that the software remain stable.

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